USS Defiant vs Death star

[InvaderSkooj 1]

I only see tie fighters have a fighting chance stopping a Defiant class starship or any Federation starships for that matter if they waiting right near that hole on the Death star other wise it just issue speed. A Defiant class starship auto pilot could reach that hole in the Death star before tie fighter could even be launched. So they have to wait their way before this battle even take place. Other wise no time to luanch excape pode none or less try stop it with ties fighters.

In TDiC it takes the defiant 12seconds to cover 50km. Assuming 0 starting velocity allows a maximum acceleration of 70Gs, well short of the hundreds of Gs of acceleration required to fly around a 200,000km gas giant in a few minutes

[Jason 27]

I could think simple way to make hole a lot bigger just us a few tricobalt devices. Then again if Defiant armed with these weapons kinds weapons in longer numbers there is no real need to go near that hole in the Death star. Ten or twenty of these weapons would blow Death star to bits.

[paul 11,988]

I could think simple way to make hole a lot bigger just us a few tricobalt devices. Then again if Defiant armed with these weapons kinds weapons in longer numbers there is no real need to go near that hole in the Death star. Ten or twenty of these weapons would blow Death star to bits.

 

 

 

Now THAT's an interesting thought that while drunk I didn't think of heh.

[Jason 27]

Now THAT's an interesting thought that while drunk I didn't think of heh.

 

Or the A defient class starship could also in thoey send commandoe team into that little hole and drop a little mine in thier to being that another blow up the Death star.

[paul 11,988]

Meh ya know what screw photon torpedos its the USS Defiant she had quantum torp's that'll take care of the DS pretty damn easily

[Jason 27]

Yes but there are so many fun ways to destroy the Death star with little hole in it when comes a Defiant class starship it would be to hard for the caption that starship to choose.

[Praeothmin 532]

Woah, this thread has become ridiculous...

 

First, the DS isn't nimble... At all...

 

Second, the Defiant isn't invulnerable... At all...

 

 

 

So while the Defiant may be able to fire at the vent, it may not be able to fire in the vent, again because if size issues.

 

So I still maintain that you need a small fleet of shuch ships to damage the DS.

 

 

 

Defiant vs Borg: this ship by itself wasn't designed to take on an entire cube, it was "optimized" to fight.

 

When they manufactured it, they thought of the Borg and figured a dedicated warship using the latest in weapons, shields and armor technology would greatly enhance Starfleet's capacity to fight the Borg...

 

So no, it didn't fail, it performs exactly as it should...

 

 

 

Tie fighters vs the Defiant...

 

They wouldn't even be able to scratch its paint, and while they may evade the Photorps (I'm sure they can, I agree Photorps aren't that maneuverable), they will not evade the Defiant's Pulse-Phasers, because the Defiant can fire-and-forget its torpedoes, and then amuse itself out-maneuvering the Ties and either firing at them or simply ramming them.

 

We are, after all, talking about paper thin hulls with weak/no shields...

 

 

 

Tricobalt devices...

 

Really, Jason, you've done the math that allows you to state with certainty that 20 Tricobalt devices would blow up the DS?

 

Just because 2 blew up the Caretaker's array, doesn't mean 20 will blow up a DS.

 

How big was the Carataker's array, compared to the DS?

 

How dense?

 

 

 

The Caretaker's array, when looking at still shots at Memory Alpha, looks about 6 times the width of Voyager.

 

The Intrepid-class is 355 meters long, so times 6, the Caretaker array is around 2100 meters wide, a far cry from the 120km of the first DS, and it is not a full sphere like the DS either.

 

I doubt very, very much that 20 Tricobalt warheads will destroy the DS.

 

They will do much damage where they hit, perhaps even do enough damage to the Superlaser's structure if fired at it, but they will certainly not blow up the DS...

[Jason 27]

Woah, this thread has become ridiculous...

 

First, the DS isn't nimble... At all...

 

Second, the Defiant isn't invulnerable... At all...

 

 

 

So while the Defiant may be able to fire at the vent, it may not be able to fire in the vent, again because if size issues.

 

So I still maintain that you need a small fleet of shuch ships to damage the DS.

 

 

 

Defiant vs Borg: this ship by itself wasn't designed to take on an entire cube, it was "optimized" to fight.

 

When they manufactured it, they thought of the Borg and figured a dedicated warship using the latest in weapons, shields and armor technology would greatly enhance Starfleet's capacity to fight the Borg...

 

So no, it didn't fail, it performs exactly as it should...

 

 

 

Tie fighters vs the Defiant...

 

They wouldn't even be able to scratch its paint, and while they may evade the Photorps (I'm sure they can, I agree Photorps aren't that maneuverable), they will not evade the Defiant's Pulse-Phasers, because the Defiant can fire-and-forget its torpedoes, and then amuse itself out-maneuvering the Ties and either firing at them or simply ramming them.

 

We are, after all, talking about paper thin hulls with weak/no shields...

 

 

 

Tricobalt devices...

 

Really, Jason, you've done the math that allows you to state with certainty that 20 Tricobalt devices would blow up the DS?

 

Just because 2 blew up the Caretaker's array, doesn't mean 20 will blow up a DS.

 

How big was the Carataker's array, compared to the DS?

 

How dense?

 

 

 

The Caretaker's array, when looking at still shots at Memory Alpha, looks about 6 times the width of Voyager.

 

The Intrepid-class is 355 meters long, so times 6, the Caretaker array is around 2100 meters wide, a far cry from the 120km of the first DS, and it is not a full sphere like the DS either.

 

I doubt very, very much that 20 Tricobalt warheads will destroy the DS.

 

They will do much damage where they hit, perhaps even do enough damage to the Superlaser's structure if fired at it, but they will certainly not blow up the DS...

 

That why I sugestin sending in a commandoes team armed few ant-matter mines see from star Terk Chain of command two. These weapons not big at all one person can easily carries one for them even in a spacesuit like what we saw in Star Trek First contact. .. Then all the commandoes have to do this throw them down the hole throw

[Praeothmin 532]

That why I sugestin sending in a commandoes team armed few ant-matter mines see from star Terk Chain of command two. These weapons not big at all one person can easily carries one for them even in a spacesuit like what we saw in Star Trek First contact. .. Then all the commandoes have to do this throw them down the hole throw

 

 

 

Since the Transporters will most likely not work due to the Magnetic shielding of the DS, how do you propose we send these Commandoes in?

 

By shuttle?

 

Through the paths of fire of the surface Turbolasers, the ones that were able to hit the more maneuverable X-Wings and Y-Wings?

 

Also, what will those mines do since they will only be able to install them on the surface?

 

You certainly don't expect the Commandoes to go very deep before they're intercepted, do?

[Jason 27]

I think about spacesuit Mr. Spock used in Star Terk The Motion Picture. If that kind spacesuit was to be used then it easily task to sending in that commandoes team. The commando team might be able to us Pattern enhancers to bring big photon torpedoes or they could carries smell Micro Photon torpedoes.

[Praeothmin 532]

I think about spacesuit Mr. Spock used in Star Terk The Motion Picture. If that kind spacesuit was to be used then it easily task to sending in that commandoes team. The commando team might be able to us Pattern enhancers to bring big photon torpedoes or they could carries smell Micro Photon torpedoes.

 

 

 

There's still the issue of those pesky Turbolaser Bolts flying around.

 

But even if they make it to the surface, they cannot do much more then arm it on the surface.

 

The pattern enhancers are only good when you try to beam from a heavy interference location back to the ship, they cannot be used at the original beaming point to beam something at another location with heavy interference.

 

 

 

So your plan cannot work, and the best course of action is still for a small fleet of vessels to destroy, or damage, the Superlaser dish/array...

[paul 11,988]

okay hold up now that I think about it -

 

 

 

Lets use this scenario -

 

 

 

Defiant blasts a hole using quantum torpedo's in the DS (which wouldn't be that hard no matter how much ya wanted to say it would be), then using runabouts launches a commando team in. The runabouts are quite agile and should be able to avoid most of the turbo lasers and that strike team could THENNN plop down some pattern enhancers and WOOP. Transport the strike force.

[Jason 27]

Turbolaser are not design to hit targets that smell and defiant class starship release them near that hole anyway. That problem solve the other interest point you make is they can not beam objects to a target. How is Caption Janeway going to transporter food and medical supplies and that baby back to the planet surface in that is the case in Star Tenk Voyager, "Friendship One" if Pattern enhancers can not help beam objects to the surface?

[InvaderSkooj 1]

Turbolaser are not design to hit targets that smell and defiant class starship .

Wrong, The defiant is 128-170m long

 

 

 

A corellian corvette is 150m long

 

 

 

A Republic cruiser is 115m

[Jason 27]

I talking about commandoes not the Defiant. The Defiant has systems that make impossible for sensor got good lock on it. Other wise explain why the Dominion smell starship have such a hard time getting a lock on it.

[Praeothmin 532]

okay hold up now that I think about it -

 

 

 

Lets use this scenario -

 

 

 

Defiant blasts a hole using quantum torpedo's in the DS (which wouldn't be that hard no matter how much ya wanted to say it would be), then using runabouts launches a commando team in. The runabouts are quite agile and should be able to avoid most of the turbo lasers and that strike team could THENNN plop down some pattern enhancers and WOOP. Transport the strike force.

 

 

 

Well, if you're going to send in some Runabouts, don't forget to send a lot, because way more maneuverable ships (X-Wings) have been hit and destroyed by the surface guns.

 

Yes, since Runabouts are built to resist Capital ship's fire, but they'll be hit more then once since they fly like bricks (I have not seen anything in DS9 to suggest they have much maneuverability) and some may be destroyed.

 

You're better off using 1 Defiant in the fleet you're using to attack which can come in low, and drop a few shuttles filled with Commandoes in.

 

Then they can use pattern enhancers to allow beaming in more teams.

 

But still, I really can't see how, say, 200 guys, no matter how good, could hold and control a station filled with hundreds of thousands of people, inclusing thousands of enemy soldiers...

 

 

 

 

 

Turbolaser are not design to hit targets that smell and defiant class starship release them near that hole anyway. That problem solve the other interest point you make is they can not beam objects to a target. How is Caption Janeway going to transporter food and medical supplies and that baby back to the planet surface in that is the case in Star Tenk Voyager, "Friendship One" if Pattern enhancers can not help beam objects to the surface?

 

 

 

Jason, the Turbolasers, while not being designed to hit targets the size of a Runabout, were still able to hit some X-wings, ships that are smaller and more maneuverable then Runabouts.

 

 

 

As for the pattern enhancers, Janeway was able to transport things back down in the pattern enhancers' area of effect.

 

They weren't used to transport food and medical supplies 300 meters outside the pattern enhancers field...

[paul 11,988]

Well, if you're going to send in some Runabouts, don't forget to send a lot, because way more maneuverable ships (X-Wings) have been hit and destroyed by the surface guns.

 

Yes, since Runabouts are built to resist Capital ship's fire, but they'll be hit more then once since they fly like bricks (I have not seen anything in DS9 to suggest they have much maneuverability) and some may be destroyed.

 

You're better off using 1 Defiant in the fleet you're using to attack which can come in low, and drop a few shuttles filled with Commandoes in.

 

Then they can use pattern enhancers to allow beaming in more teams.

 

But still, I really can't see how, say, 200 guys, no matter how good, could hold and control a station filled with hundreds of thousands of people, inclusing thousands of enemy soldiers...

 

No, I don't think runabouts are more maneuverable than x-wings but they aren't clunky thats for sure, and it's not like they're going in to capture said DS (unless they really wanted too i suppose), they could go in, surgical strike the key areas then out they go. Now if they are using the shuttles with armor like admiral janeways shuttle then god help them (Course then transphasic torpedos would be a nice addition) hehe.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Jason, the Turbolasers, while not being designed to hit targets the size of a Runabout, were still able to hit some X-wings, ships that are smaller and more maneuverable then Runabouts.

 

 

 

As for the pattern enhancers, Janeway was able to transport things back down in the pattern enhancers' area of effect.

 

They weren't used to transport food and medical supplies 300 meters outside the pattern enhancers field...

 

 

Once inside they could easily setup pattern enhancers to get out to safety thus ending said mission and they can stand on the deck of a cruiser with a big banner that says Mission Accomlished (HAH I made a funny!)

 

 

 

 

[Jason 27]

I thinking that commandoes us the same spacesuit Mr. Spock used in Star Terk The Motion Picture how to get to that hole.Then clim into that hole once inside they place pattern enhancers beam in a photon torpodes into that hole and then beam selves back Defiant and Death Star would expoded.

[Praeothmin 532]

I thinking that commandoes us the same spacesuit Mr. Spock used in Star Terk The Motion Picture how to get to that hole.Then clim into that hole once inside they place pattern enhancers beam in a photon torpodes into that hole and then beam selves back Defiant and Death Star would expoded.

 

 

 

Even with pattern enhancers, I have never heard any ship in ST beaming people through 60km of rock or metal, ripe with interference.

 

If you absolutely want your commandoes to get a Photorp down that exaust port, then he'll have to push an unactivated torpedo, and detonate it himself once he's down there, or put it on a timer...

 

Good luck...

[Jason 27]

That hole in the Death star has no mental in the way. I do not see the problem.

[Tyralak 12,068]

That hole in the Death star has no mental in the way. I do not see the problem.

 

 

 

I brought this up too. I still think a case could be made for doing it this way, unless there is too much interference for the transporter to work.

[Praeothmin 532]

I brought this up too. I still think a case could be made for doing it this way, unless there is too much interference for the transporter to work.

 

 

 

And that's the unknown.

 

First, does the transporter beam need to have direct line of sight, or can the vent be used as some sort of waveguide?

 

Second, how much interference would there be in a vent that is linked directly to the generator core.

 

Also, how can the transporters work to begin with through the DS's magnetic shielding?

 

And remember why they couldn't use the fighter's cannon on that vent?

 

It was ray shielded...

 

So if energy beams cannot go through, how could transporter beams do so?

[Jason 27]

I do not think that hole has a rayshield protect it form harm.

[enigma 521]

Yes it does.

[Tyralak 12,068]

And that's the unknown.

 

First, does the transporter beam need to have direct line of sight, or can the vent be used as some sort of waveguide?

 

Second, how much interference would there be in a vent that is linked directly to the generator core.

 

Also, how can the transporters work to begin with through the DS's magnetic shielding?

 

And remember why they couldn't use the fighter's cannon on that vent?

 

It was ray shielded...

 

So if energy beams cannot go through, how could transporter beams do so?

 

 

 

Yeah, if it's ray shielded, it's unlikely a transporter beam could penetrate. If it wasn't I'm certain it could be used as a waveguide. Being in the communications industry, I know a thing or two about frequencies. I can definitely explain how the vent could be used as a waveguide. In fact, the very thing that would inhibit direct beaming into the core would ENHANCE the effectiveness of beaming through the vent. It would keep the signal attenuation to a bare minimum, while virtually eliminating egress. It's the same reason you don't bury 1000 feet of RG-59 and expect anything usable out the other end. You would use RG-11.