garypen 0 Posted August 10, 2009 The first three SW movies are excellent fantasy adventures. (Eps 4,5, and 6) But, I prefer ST, as it is much more science-fiction-based entertainment. Voyager kinda sucked. And, they appeared to cancel Enterprise just as it was getting good. But, some of the best sci-fi ever made were episodes of STNG, DS9, and even TOS, despite its limited budget and primitive sfx. But, since ST and SW are actually two different genres, true comparisons can not be made, nor should they. It's like comparing apples and chocolate. What's the point? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
enigma 521 Posted August 10, 2009 Hang the infidel! Bring out the torches and pitchforks! In a more serious tone, ST is no more sci-fi than SW. Shows that are true (or close to it) sci-fi would be, Battlestar Galactica, Firefly and Babylon 5. I like both ST and SW. I somewhat prefer ST but side with SW in vs. scenarios. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tyralak 12,068 Posted August 10, 2009 Good to see you here, Gary. This is a copy and paste from the old ASVS FAQ on the SF Debris site about this: The Official ASVS FAQ B. Why bother debating this? 1. Don't you people have a life? 2. Don't you get it? None of it's real! 3. Why are you even arguing because Star Trek/Wars sucks anyway? 4. Why can't you understand that both shows are good in their own ways? 1. Don't you people have a life? * Of course we do. The people who discuss in this group cover many different walks of life: high school students, college students, graduate students, working professionals in a wide variety of careers and scattered over every continent except Antarctica (and one of our denizens has actually been there, so quite the globetrotters be we). In other words, this is not a collection of geeks: these are real people who just happen to enjoy talking about this subject; and no we're not wearing pointed ears or stormtrooper helmets. 2. Don't you get it? None of it's real! * Of course it's not real. No one is disputing this. This is just a technical discussion of fiction, no different than fantasy football. You discuss as if it is real, even though you know it is not. 3. Why are you even arguing because Star Trek/Wars sucks anyway? * You are entitled to your opinion. However, other people have the right to their opinion too. A well-thought out opinion will be respected; stupidity will be mocked for what it is. 4. Why can't you understand that both shows are good in their own ways? * Many people do like both Star Trek and Star Wars. Some prefer one, and some the other. Still others like what Trek/Wars used to be and hate what it is now. Personal opinions vary. But just because someone argues against Trek doesn't mean they hate Trek. Ditto for Star Wars. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
garypen 0 Posted August 10, 2009 <p class='citation'>Quote</p><div class="blockquote"><div class='quote'>In a more serious tone, ST is no more sci-fi than SW.</div></div>You're absolutely incorrect. But, I'm curious as to your logic in coming to that erroneous conclusion. I will certainly agree about B5, and take it a step further in saying that if B5 had DS9's budget (DS9 being its contemporary, and in many respects, its copy), it would have been the finest Sci-Fi series to ever grace TV. But, BG is certainly no more Sci-Fi than ST, and, IMO, actually less so. It is also a fantasy/adventure story, not totally unlike SW. After all, the original BG was basically a SW ripoff for TV. And, Firefly/Serenity, which I enjoyed, is also a bit heavy on the action/adventure, and a little less on the science part of fiction. Fun, yes. But, not what one would consider serious science fiction. I'm noticing a current trend in sci-fi which is leaning away from science, and leaning far more towards action. Even the latest ST movie has fallen victim to this trend. But, at least it kept mostly to its Sci-Fi roots, unlike horseshit such as Transformers, The Island, or Armageddon. (Perhaps Michael Bay should take a few lessons from James Cameron, who managed to blend solid sci-fi with top-notch action in movies like T2 and Aliens.) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Airlocke 12,014 Posted August 12, 2009 I have to agree, Star Trek is more of a Sci-fi than Star Wars. Str Wars is a fantasy in a sci-fi setting, while Star Trek is a sci-fi show with an adventure-type story. They both have elements of other genre's, but Star Trek is sci-fi first, as opposed to Star Wars. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StarDestroyerAvenger 2,147,483,647 Posted October 5, 2009 but side with SW in vs. scenarios. Because only fucktards would actually think that a fucking hand phaser could actually demolish a building or that a Federation fleet, let alone a single starship, can actually level a planet. The delusions and obsessions of Trekkies never ceases to amaze me, and this website is living proof of that. The only reason why this site exists is because losers like Tyralak and RayCav are either too afraid or are outright banned from standing toe-to-toe on SDN and actually testing their moronic beliefs on a real intellectual battlefield, a battlefield that was cleared in victory ages ago. And why the fuck are you even here Enigma? I know for a fucking fact that you go to SDN so why the hell are you wasting your time here? Well, let's see.... Star Trek: - Voyager - Enterprise - Insurrection - Nemesis Star Wars: - Episode 1 - Episode 2 - Episode 3 - The Clone Wars yeah, I'd say they're about both equal in quality Oh fuck you. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
enigma 521 Posted October 5, 2009 Because only fucktards would actually think that a fucking hand phaser could actually demolish a building or that a Federation fleet, let alone a single starship, can actually level a planet. The delusions and obsessions of Trekkies never ceases to amaze me, and this website is living proof of that. The only reason why this site exists is because losers like Tyralak and RayCav are either too afraid or are outright banned from standing toe-to-toe on SDN and actually testing their moronic beliefs on a real intellectual battlefield, a battlefield that was cleared in victory ages ago. And why the fuck are you even here Enigma? I know for a fucking fact that you go to SDN so why the hell are you wasting your time here? Oh fuck you. I'm here for the fun of it. I'm not a very good debater and this site is like one huge Testing forum. If you've read my posting history here, you'd see that I am taking the SW side. Here is like being at a bar where we can knock heads where at SDN is like a debate club. Don't take my being here seriously. I'm just having some fun and there are a few here that have been banned from SDN that I do not mind chatting with. They may have messed up over at SDN but that doesn't mean they are horrible people. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tyralak 12,068 Posted October 5, 2009 I'm here for the fun of it. I'm not a very good debater and this site is like one huge Testing forum. If you've read my posting history here, you'd see that I am taking the SW side. Here is like being at a bar where we can knock heads where at SDN is like a debate club. Don't take my being here seriously. I'm just having some fun and there are a few here that have been banned from SDN that I do not mind chatting with. They may have messed up over at SDN but that doesn't mean they are horrible people. So, you're basically saying you're slumming being here? Enigma, I was never banned there. I never messed up there. I just don't go. Again, this place is NOT about SDN. Whoever this clown is, he's spamming the board talking about SDN non stop. Once he settles down, gets over his obsession, and starts making some useful posts, we'll see what he really is. We'll see if he has anything useful to say or is just someone who gets off on ad hominem attacks. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StarDestroyerAvenger 2,147,483,647 Posted October 5, 2009 I'm here for the fun of it. I'm not a very good debater and this site is like one huge Testing forum. If you've read my posting history here, you'd see that I am taking the SW side. Here is like being at a bar where we can knock heads where at SDN is like a debate club. Don't take my being here seriously. I'm just having some fun and there are a few here that have been banned from SDN that I do not mind chatting with. They may have messed up over at SDN but that doesn't mean they are horrible people. LOL you have got to be shitting me. RayCav was banned because he's a fucking psychopath and probably a rapist. He truly is the worst kind of person there is. I don't recognize anybody else but if anybody else banned from SDN is using a handle then they've been banned for good reason. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
enigma 521 Posted October 5, 2009 So, you're basically saying you're slumming being here? Enigma, I was never banned there. I never messed up there. I just don't go. Again, this place is NOT about SDN. Whoever this clown is, he's spamming the board talking about SDN non stop. Once he settles down, gets over his obsession, and starts making some useful posts, we'll see what he really is. We'll see if he has anything useful to say or is just someone who gets off on ad hominem attacks. I'm not saying you were. Just saying that there are those who were banned in SDN that I didn't mind chatting with. Of course I deal with you more than the rest but trying to show that there are those that are not too bad. SDA thinks RayCav is sick from what he posted here. He must have a very low tolerance. RayCav now is pretty much mellowed since his ASVS years. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StarDestroyerAvenger 2,147,483,647 Posted October 5, 2009 SDA thinks RayCav is sick from what he posted here. He must have a very low tolerance. RayCav now is pretty much mellowed since his ASVS years. LOL it's not what I think it's a fucking fact. Just ask anybody from SDN. We had a thread not too long ago talking about him and most people agree that he'll never come back to SDN because he's a sick fuck. Marina even said so and I'm pretty sure she's originally from ASVS. I bet she has to double check that all her doors are locked at night because she's afraid that RayCav is stalking her and wants to kill her. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
enigma 521 Posted October 5, 2009 LOL it's not what I think it's a fucking fact. Just ask anybody from SDN. We had a thread not too long ago talking about him and most people agree that he'll never come back to SDN because he's a sick fuck. Marina even said so and I'm pretty sure she's originally from ASVS. I bet she has to double check that all her doors are locked at night because she's afraid that RayCav is stalking her and wants to kill her. So? Shep was not different. Go read what he did over at ASVS and read the posts Graeme made about him. Attacked his father with a shotgun, AFAIK made threats to Wong about his kids(fuzzy on that). He was and still an overall asshole that had been banned once over at SDN but he got the chance to redeem himself (but I do think that eventually he'll get himself banned). RayCav never got that far. The board thought he was gross and dropped him fast and hard. I do think that if allowed back in, that he'd do well. Just thinking that he'll never change is quite frankly stupid beyond belief. Nevertheless, I'm more tolerant of others than you are. You don't like him then fine. It isn't like I'll be clubbing with him but plain faceless conversation. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StarDestroyerAvenger 2,147,483,647 Posted October 5, 2009 So? Shep was not different. Go read what he did over at ASVS and read the posts Graeme made about him. Attacked his father with a shotgun, AFAIK made threats to Wong about his kids(fuzzy on that). He was and still an overall asshole that had been banned once over at SDN but he got the chance to redeem himself (but I do think that eventually he'll get himself banned). RayCav never got that far. The board thought he was gross and dropped him fast and hard. I do think that if allowed back in, that he'd do well. Just thinking that he'll never change is quite frankly stupid beyond belief. Nevertheless, I'm more tolerant of others than you are. You don't like him then fine. It isn't like I'll be clubbing with him but plain faceless conversation. LOL whatever. Just read what SDN has to say about that sick fucker: http://bbs.stardestroyer.net/search.php?keywords=raycav&terms=all&author=&sc=1&sf=all&sk=t&sd=d&sr=posts&st=0&ch=300&t=0&submit=Search Even you had shit to say about him in there too. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
enigma 521 Posted October 5, 2009 LOL whatever. Just read what SDN has to say about that sick fucker: http://bbs.stardestr...0&submit=Search Even you had shit to say about him in there too. I do not see where I bashed him. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Airlocke 12,014 Posted October 5, 2009 I really do not see how effective of an evaluation tool others' opinions are for the value of an individual. That thread just shows that he pissed a few people off. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StarDestroyerAvenger 2,147,483,647 Posted October 6, 2009 For the last time its not opinion its fact. RayCav is a fucking psychopath. End of story. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tyralak 12,068 Posted October 6, 2009 For the last time its not opinion its fact. RayCav is a fucking psychopath. End of story. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StarDestroyerAvenger 2,147,483,647 Posted October 6, 2009 LOL your debate skills are as sharp and witty as ever, I see. Even in your little hidey-hole there will be people like me who will smack you down for the idiot that you are. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Praeothmin 532 Posted October 6, 2009 LOL your debate skills are as sharp and witty as ever, I see. At least as sharp as yours, anyway... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Questor 501 Posted October 14, 2009 In a more serious tone, ST is no more sci-fi than SW. Shows that are true (or close to it) sci-fi would be, Battlestar Galactica, Firefly and Babylon 5. Going back on topic here, this is an interesting discussion in and of itself, "What genre do different shows fall into?" Science Fiction, as it is used in the popular parlance is a very broad genre, encompassing all other genres, and even having a few specific sub-genres. The Sci-Fi/Fantasy genre encompasses almost every traditional genre from romance to mystery, and has its own highly specific sub-genres like military sci-fi, horror, high fantasy, space opera, alternate history, and world building. Just about the only other "genre" that is as broad is historical fiction. Other literary groupings that large are considered categories, like "Young Adult." One of the problems is that when many people in the vs community start talking about Sci-Fi, they only think of the Space Opera genre, and this leads to the argument that ST and SW are not in the same genre. They are in the same overbroad genre, but they are in very different sub-genres, one being for the most part television (encompassing whatever genre the writers felt like writing in that week), and the other being straight space opera. If you want to compare STI-VI and SW from a literary standpoint, your much closer. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StarDestroyerAvenger 2,147,483,647 Posted October 14, 2009 Star Trek is on the same level as your average soap opera. It's got soap opera plots, soap opera writing and soap opera characters. It's pretty much a soap opera in space. Wong even says as much but of course if you ever bother to go to SDN you'd know that. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Questor 501 Posted October 14, 2009 Wong even says as much but of course if you ever bother to go to SDN you'd know that. Are you a fucking idiot, or did you just forget to plug in whatever defective random word generator you use for a brain? Seriously, if you're going to troll someone, do it fucking right, actually know my history, along with the history of a lot of the others here on this board. Enigma and I even use the exact same fucking handles on SDNet. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Praeothmin 532 Posted October 14, 2009 Wong even says as much but of course if you ever bother to go to SDN you'd know that. Yeah, we get it SDA: You have no personal opinion on anything and what Wong says is gospel truth to you... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Questor 501 Posted October 14, 2009 Yeah, we get it SDA: You have no personal opinion on anything and what Wong says is gospel truth to you... Sounds almost like religious fundamentalism, in fact. And we all know what Wong thinks of fundamentalism... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
