A little problem with Coruscant, and other city worlds.

[Khas 12,158]

As explained by "Irregular Webcomic"'s author. Read below the actual comic, and you'll see why Coruscant couldn't exist.

http://www.irregularwebcomic.net/417.html

[scvn2812 504]

An exceptional ability to deal with waste heat is pretty much a given for every last mainstream scifi universe. Especially those that wield enough energy to blow up planets but even those that are closer to our reality still would have to have an enormously superior, basically magical, way to deal with waste heat. Running a nuclear reactor for example would require a lot of radiators. I can't seem to dig up the Atomic Rockets page that talked in more detail about it. Suffice to say, my understanding is that just about every ship in popular scifi that either accelerates at more than a snail's pace or uses energy weapons would need a massive amount of heat disposal gear or just flat out can't work.

Edited August 4, 2012 by scvn2812

[Khas 12,158]

Well, considering that SW really does have magic in it....

 

And no, I'm not talking about the Force. I'm talking about these:

http://www.starwars.com/explore/encyclopedia/groups/nightsisterzombies/

http://www.starwars.com/explore/encyclopedia/groups/nightsisters/

[scvn2812 504]

Well, considering that SW really does have magic in it....

 

And no, I'm not talking about the Force. I'm talking about these:

http://www.starwars.com/explore/encyclopedia/groups/nightsisterzombies/

http://www.starwars.com/explore/encyclopedia/groups/nightsisters/

 

Read some of the books they were in, they're force users who approach the force as if it were magic. I don't know if that was retconned in the series or not, haven't seen their episodes. As Palpatine said, the Dark Side of the Force is a gateway to many abilities that some would call unnatural...

[Khas 12,158]

I think it was retconned, as SW.com probably would have said that they were Force-sensitive.

[scvn2812 504]

I'm sure the admiral on the Death Star whom Vader warned not to be too proud of his technological terror would be quite shocked by what goes on on Dathomir. Maybe not quite as much after being choked by the mind of the guy he just mocked for his sorcerers ways and silly religion...

[Tyralak 12,068]

Well, according to the Foundation series, Trantor got rid of it's waste heat by extending large radiators on the night side of the planet as it rotated. Not sure how effective that would actually be, but that's how they dealt with it in the books.

[scvn2812 504]

Asimov would think of such a thing. I really need to read more of his work. My rocket punk cred is a bit limited. Some Clarke here, some Heinlein there but there's always more to discover...

[Khas 12,158]

Bump. I've been reading more into City Planets, and frankly, they just don't work. Sure, you can have radiators, but they'd need to be ridiculously massive. And you can't have too many, or else, you'd lose efficiency, as the radiators would just radiate heat into each other, and we all know that's just a recipe for disaster. And the surface conditions of Coruscant would be near the melting point of lead, anyway.

 

This also brings in my main conflict with the power generation figures of the ICS. Every time we see a ship in an atmosphere, and if they were generating star-like levels of power. we'd see the air around it get superheated. You know how thunder is created when lightning superheats the air? It would be like that, but much larger. Considering that Lucas has said that antigrav tech exists in SW, (it was mentioned on the History Channel special "Star Wars Tech". Which aired at about the same time as "Star Trek Tech". Both aired on History Channel in 2006, which was, bizzarely enough, the same year I got interested in the Versus Debate), I think it's more reasonable to presume that Antigrav is used in landing and taking off, as well as in space, as antigrav would reduce the effective mass of the starship, making it easier to move. Considering that humans as a whole like efficiency (except for the occasional "Screw Efficiency, We're Doing What's Awesome" thing, but these are relatively rare, as they tend to be incredibly impractical.), especially in military matters, this would make sense.

[Captain Seafort 17]

Bump. I've been reading more into City Planets, and frankly, they just don't work.

 

In reality, sure. Coruscant obviously does though.

 

Sure, you can have radiators, but they'd need to be ridiculously massive. And you can't have too many, or else, you'd lose efficiency, as the radiators would just radiate heat into each other, and we all know that's just a recipe for disaster.

 

One word: neutrinos. SW vessels (and probably city-planets as well) use neutrino radiators to dump excess heat, which removes the problem of the dumped heat interacting with the environment. Yes, it's effectively magic, but so are hyperdrives, lightsabers, and pretty much every other technology in SW.

[Khas 12,158]

I guess I'm just tired of seeing people treat ST and SW as hard sci-fi. ESPECIALLY since the KirkSkywalker saga on SFJ. What an idiot that guy was.

[Captain Seafort 17]

I guess I'm just tired of seeing people treat ST and SW as hard sci-fi.

 

Who the fuck treats either of them as hard sf? And where's the WTF smilie when you need it?

 

ESPECIALLY since the KirkSkywalker saga on SFJ.

 

Never go there myself - what did this character get up to?

[Vince 520]

Yea, its not magic though no, its technobabble - science we just don't understand it!

 

ST obviously try to make everything sound like it is scientific and thus possible, and SW makes it look likes its supposed to be scientific and thus possible; both actually equate to the technobabble.

Hence we end up with things like "neutrino radiators" or "warp fields" and functional teleportation devices, which all work on the in-universe "science".

[Khas 12,158]

Who the fuck treats either of them as hard sf? And where's the WTF smilie when you need it?

 

 

 

Never go there myself - what did this character get up to?

 

KirkSkywalker treats them as hard. Ugh, KirkSkywalker. This guy should have an Encyclopedia Dramatica page written about him, he was such a pain in the ass.

 

He started off as a relatively positive Pro-Trek debater. He had some interesting ideas, like that Midichlorians were actually parasites, causing the SW galaxy to stagnate, and that the Force was causing the SW galaxy's history to essentially be one big loop. However, he started going over to the butthurt side when he wanted to know how to edit this one ST-vs-SW video that, even though it showed the Enterprise-D easily clobbering the Executor, it also showed Vader force-choking the E-D crew (except for Data, who escaped), into having ST win all the way. When he started spouting crazier theories, and wouldn't give proof, we called him out on it. Then he created a sockpuppet, called "SarahStar", to make it look like people agreed with him. When he was called out on that too, he pretty much did a ragequit, and left. Then he came back under another sockpuppet (I think it was UniversalNetGuru, though I could be mistaken. I know that was one of them, though), and started making all sorts of other wild claims, as well as flamebaiting other members, and accusing everyone (And I mean EVERYONE) who didn't agree with his nonsensical theories of being a troll for SDN. Here's one post that should really tell you all you need to know about him:

 

We know that hyperdriven ships aren't invulnerable, since they can hit stars and supenovas etc. Also, ships can't go more than 20,000C at hyperdrive in the G-canon, meanwhile phasers can go a lot faster than that.

 

 

 

Hyperdrive apparently works by shifting the ship's mass to tachyonic matter.

 

Normally this makes the ship invulnerable to SW weapons, since their weapons are STL. However that won't be the case against Federation weaponry. Also some starships are faster than hyperdriven ships, so hyperdrive wouldn't be an advantage in combat.

 

Finally, federation sensors can detect warp-signatures of fast-moving ships, so it's not like they could just pop out of nowhere like they claim. Instead, they'd just be intercepted and fired upon while in hyperspace, preferably with anti-tachyon beams.... boom.

 

Yeah.

 

There is so much that can be said about this guy that it's impossible to fit it all on one post.

 

As for the WTF smiley, either I or Afishymeadow will import that.

[Khas 12,158]

Also, compare StarWarsStarTrek, his Pro-Wars equivalent. Seeing those two debate was... ugly.

[Khas 12,158]

Oh, got the WTF smiley for you:

 

[Captain Seafort 17]

Cheers.

 

As for Mr KirkSkywalker...wow. Although scarily I'm not sure if it's the most bonkers "theory" I've ever heard or not.

[Khas 12,158]

He's also come to the conclusion that ST and SW are the same franchise, just set in different galaxies, and split up among different owners.

[Khas 12,158]

StarWarsStarTrek was just as bad. As I said, he was the Pro-Wars equivalent of KirkSkywalker. Some of this moron's stunts include, but were not limited to:

-Posting Fan-edited Dominion War videos that featured clips from Starship Troopers and new Battlestar Galactica as "Proof" of yields, even when it was blatantly obvious that the clips in those videos weren't from ST.

 

-Ignoring any evidence of high-yield ST claims, even when they were posted multiple times, just saying "evidence?"

 

-And, the ultimate piece of derp, using obviously photoshopped fanart as evidence. The pic in question:

 

He claimed that it showed that ST had pitiful weapons yields and ranges. Yeah, you can just feel the intelligence at work here.

 

What was worse was when KirkSkywalker and StarWarsStarTrek started debating each other.

[Khas 12,158]

SWST's main debating tactic was this:

 

Lie.

Lie about lying.

Lie about lying about lying to cover up the fact that he lied in the first place.

 

That is, when he wasn't being a simpering idiot.

[Captain Seafort 17]

What was worse was when KirkSkywalker and StarWarsStarTrek started debating each other.

 

Really? It sounds like pitching these two against each other could be good entertainment.

[Khas 12,158]

You'd think seeing two idiots wail on each other would be funny. It isn't when each post is filled to the brim with vitriol not only against each other, but against every other poster on the site as well.