Mr. Oragahn

Just lame. It's just funny how Hollywwod is so creatively bankrupt that even the viewers are now asking for more of those microwaved stories. There's almost not a single spectacular movie that's not a reboot, an adaptation, a sequel or a prequel. Greed has never been that high. Easy cash more than ever, not even an attempt at something half original. Of course on the other hand when they do original, it has to be so padded with CGI that its production costs alone are rivaling the GNP of several countries.

Where's Prophet? Your thread is dying. And we need some beer btw.

I never said an ISD couldn't take multiple nukes. But multiple nukes, in a nuclear ready scenario, is going to be brought to the table rather easily, and the Colonials have enough means to deliver them. And since the scenario is just a question of how many Mercuries to get an ISD down, if one massive BSG and all its ammo, crews and Viper and Raptor wings isn't enough, then two. I already covered that part. The ISD has the advantage is better weaponry, and more advanced defenses to some degree, but it's certainly not safe. I already pointed out that if we go with the terajoule figures for the ISD, then its shields can be taken down by even the basic colonial nukes. And from ROTS and TCWS, I'm just sorry to say that, but it's abundantly clear that the hull strength is far from being remarkable. To me, Battlestars have shown far superior resilience in this department than Star Destroyers. I'd love to see a shieldless Venator or a shieldless Invisible Hand cope with the kind of fire the Galactica had to deal with twice, first in orbit of the Algae planet, secondly after ramming the Cylon Colony. I'd also like to see those same ships take nuclear detonations to their hulls like Battlestars did and continue to remain operative. What we saw in TCWS is not impressing me. A Venator is just as screwed when ramming a Lucrehulk battleship than Pegasus was after ramming a Basestar, and that was after taking a punishment quite different than the puny crashes from Vulture Droids. Heck, even the basic missiles carried by Vipers have been seen to be able to crack open asteroids much bigger than Vipers, and make their core glow, and that's far more damage than the kamikaze Vultures were dealing, explosives within them or not. SW capital ships move like beached whales, just like nBSG ships, so that makes both universes candidates for a rather even battle, even if one universe's ships are technically outclassed, but not overwhelmingly either. The Pegasus' forward projectile batteries seem good enough to deal massive destruction to structures. You can see how they rape Basestars in a very few shots. I suppose that the non nuclear warheads would obviously be built to be armour piercing btw. And that would apply to both Colonials AND Cylons. It would be immensely stupid not to do so when it's a rather basic idea.

Torpedo Kirk should do it.

THe ROTJ novelization has thermonuclear weapons used against Mon Cal ships, and I'm yet to see evidence that they are even in the mid megaton region. Anakin was going to bomb the bridge of the Malevolence with proton torps which didn't look particularly powerful. Quite luckily, they'd be about as powerful as those seen used by the X-wings, which are rated at near 1 kT in the Technical Journal, and that fits. There's also the fact that tylium, used both for fuel and sometimes for explosives, can have an enthalpy of 500 TJ/kg. Vipers can launch nukes: So can Raptors: Those proved devastating to a Death Star sized Cylon Colony parked somewhere in the accretion disk of a black hole. Simply put, if those Mercuries are nuclear-ready, the ISD will suffer. It will also be a bad day for the Imperial crew if we take into account the numerous hints at ISDs having terajoules of firepower, and the fact that Pegasus alone tanked three nukes which cut off her FTL drive, but didn't dramatically damage her. Those nukes would, at the very, very least, be rated at 50 KT each, although there's no reason for the Cylons not to launch the "heavier" nukes, especially since the 50 KT are launched by raiders and the Basestars used the same launchers to fire those megaton nukes during the holocaust; The problem with nukes is that sometimes it renders tylium ore inert, so that's another reason why nuclear attacks are a bad thing in nBSG, because it's possible they have similar effects on tylium fuel.

I think it's pretty clear that unless we begin to roll out unreasonable numbers of Battlestars, Trek easily takes it, nuclear preparation or not. The nuclear preparation is almost a special scenario, but what is obvious is that the more Battlestars you have, the more captains there will be left after the first minutes of engagement to understand that they're facing something they can't engage with pulling punches. With nuclear prep, the ISD is not safe, that's all. Trek ships are just too much agile, powerful and advanced. They're no fun.

Nice. Could we have more information, like, err... what they plan to do, where they first meet, what they can conquer, and what's the resources of both sides? What's the Ancients at their height? It's quite vague. You could say that they were at their height before the plague, since the move to Pegasus was like an attempt at saving furniture with all the healthy ones. Yet, the problem is that before moving to Pegasus, they weren't at war with anyone. They started fighting the Wraith at around -8100 BC iirc. What's the Forerunner's most iconic achievements, and in a more technological way, what's the best techs they brought? It's pretty much a binary star about to split, so it might be a tricky in the meantime.

I must say that the way you worded your question sounds very odd. Are you asking how many Mercury-class Battlestars (like the Pegasus) it takes to destroy each one of those ships? It depends on how they are prepared. If the Vipers and Raptors are fitted with nukes, according to what we saw in the last seasons of nBSG, it could actually turn out to be a dangerous situation for several of those ships. Without that, I don't think it's going to be good. Admittedly, the Colonial ships have decoys which could lure enemy ships to some moderate degree, but Trek sensors are just too good. SW sensors, a tad below, but not by much, so I doubt they'd be fooled. So the only chance of dealing some hurt to enemy ships is in a scenario wherein the Colonials have really decided to deploy their greatest firepower. We are, of course, talking about Battlestars which are in pristine condition, with full crews, fighter and bomber complements, and munitions. Now, let's get something out of the debate right there: the Battlestars will fall very quickly. I think the ISD is the weakest of all, notably due to its weapon type which is fire and forget, without any homing capacity since it's bolts. The ISD: At several 2-3 digits terajoules bolts, It will need several volleys to destroy one Mercury. The ISD's much superior weapon range means it can even keep its shields on the lowest setting. But that is in the vain hope that Mercury captains would jump too far from the ISDs, which is not obvious since Battlestar captains rarely place their ships out of their own fire range, which is pretty close (something like 15 km tops on the average). TIEs and other crafts will be capable of harassing the Pegasus by launching missiles (but I think the Pegasus may use a combination of ECM and flak to destroy most of them). That said, unless those Imperial crafts carry high kiloton firepower, the Pegasus will be mildly annoyed. For example, if Imperial ships use proton torps at near 1 KT (the yield given in the SW Technical Journal for the X-wings' proton torpedoes), they wouldn't hurt a Mercury much. Not to say that the weapons would be shot down in droves, and Imperial crafts are clearly not tough enough to survive to the close range defenses. What they can do, however, is chase and shoot down the Vipers Mk-VII and Raptors, so much that the Colonials would not be able to fire many nukes. It also depends on the distance between both ships. We've seen that nukes fired from the Colonial crafts can actually cover large distances very quickly. The Imperials have simply nothing to shoot such things down. Considering how close a Mercury is likely to jump, it's going to be very tough for Imperial crafts to intercept Vipers and Raptors soon enough. However if an ISD has an ECM system in place, it might has its chances at fooling the rather primitive Colonial missiles. I say might because the Cylons would obviously know about the ECM and yet it never really prevented Colonial missiles from hitting their Basestars or their Resurrection Ships, or even the Resurrection Hub. That's assuming they even put the ECM up soon enough. Now, two Mercuries shall be more than enough to get the ISD down. Sure, both Mercuries will be destroyed, but the ISD's complement of small crafts won't be enough to match the numbers launched from both Mercuries before nukes are fired. Add that to the likely close fighting range between so many beached whales, and the ISD is quite toasted. The E-E may be the luckiest of the lot since her phaser strips could target the nukes and easily evade all the other forms of firepower. Mundane heavy colonial missiles wouldn't be a problem either. The Defiant may not be able to dodge the nukes, but both Trek ships don't need to fight at any close range. They can really sit at a far distance, even after the Mercuries have jumped in, and fire. Plus with the technobabble and dishes, they can easily jam the primitive missiles imho. Now, if we're dealing with DS9-style close range battles, then missiles are agile enough to possibly get a hit. There's also the obvious answer that you can add as many Mercuries as it takes before both Trek ships run out of antimatter and torpedoes. So it's quite doable against an ISD, with sufficient preparation and full nuclear load ready on all small crafts, but totally overkill against Trek ships, which win hands down.

In TFoR, Spartans could carry hemispheres on their backs, each worth 30 MT and could be glued to walls with some "quick n' easy" straps or something. Must have not been very heavy. On the other hand, wasn't the UNSC rather low on nukes?

A mix of CPLF and Thanatos, and a pinch of Skyzeta, as far as the VS forum goes. They weren't even bothered to use warnings and the points system. CPLF was covering the Star Wars side of things, mostly making Leo's task easier. Thanatos did ban me once during that ICS-debating period. Then I moved to Warhammer 40000, and that's where Thanatos entirely assumed the latest bans. For the last two bans, I contacted several mods to get clarifications, and got shit. Now to really understand what went on, you'll have to read this, sorry: *Sigh* Another case of biased moderation when SW is involved Attn: Thanatos and this post... That's puzzling. How the hell could the Covenant not manage to spread any probes over that region of space? Is their FTL slow or their communications stricly STL somehow? I really can't get it. It's especially absurd considering that since the human worlds could only be beyond the first human colonies they found, they'd knew where to throw their probes. Even when working on light sensors, with a radius of 10 LY you'd get data that's 10 years old at worse, which is not dramatic considering the age of the UNSC. 500 LY is really a small distance to cross for the Goa'uld, and we know they have all sorts of long range monitoring systems. No opinion, really. I don't care much about Jason.

First thread. First try. And obviously, very lazy. I'm merely going to copy Dessolution's thread from spacebattles, while sparing us from the amount of absurd arguments going on over there, with Monster 104 (who claims to have watched all of Stargate but keeps making some the most stupid points I've seen in ages, and who obviously struggles to contain his anti-SG hatred), Puzzled Mind, Laird and so on. The setting itself doesn't even begin to make sense, since it's relying on a conflicting background. Let's just begin by filtering out anything remotely related to the Forerunners. Thus, despite the attempt by some Haloites at SBC trying to use the UNSC as it was around the end of the five-years long war, we'll get an UNSC which has never gotten its hands on Covenant tech or Forerunner tech (the Covenants tech being a considerably watered down Forerunner tech in many ways). We'll then consider that humanity has evolved to the point it became the UNSC and got rid of most of the dissenting groups. I could limit myself to this simple statement, but let's try to imagine what goes on. Now, continuing with the complicated premise, we have to consider that this space faring civilization/organization which counts several dozen main worlds IIRC and up to 800 colonies has never found a single planet with a Stargate, never met any Goa'uld, and was never contacted either by the Tok'ra or the Asgard or else. It's even worse since Abydos was the only world which could be reached because stellar drift wasn't too considerable by then. So yes, they just happened to miss Abydos, one of the closest inhabitable planets to Earth! And of course, since this is the UNSC and not "our" Earth, they only start playing with that new stargate they got around at best in 2163-2164, when the UNSC is created. So much for stellar drift. I told you, the setting was silly. It's literally unworkable, but I guess that didn't prevent your smart debaters from over there to notice this slight problem I guess. Oh, and of course, since the thread is absolutely vague, we don't even know who the Goa'uld are precisely when they're met a few days after the UNSC gets to Abydos. Obviously, chances that it would be Ra himself are rather slim. By this time far in the future, the naqadah mines in the region may even be completely depleted and like with everything established in the show, Abydos would probably be treated as a less than a backwater world. But let's not stop there. By the OP, the UNSC figures out how to work the stargate. Obviously, the UNSC must go to Abydos. To do so, they'd either have an AI realize why most connections didn't work. Firstly, they'd need to try all possible combinations. Considering that they wouldn't have a DHD, which generally lack one symbol, they'd have to try all permutations, starting by 39. Without necessarily knowing about the point of origin, they could compose a valid address but never activate the stargate without the PoO. And then, of course, stellar drift completely nullifies such attemps. But let's keep stellar drift out, as they wouldn't know about it. All that they could figure out is that the symbols would be constellations. That's all, and that such constellations could be related to coordinates. And they had to dial that stargate manually, by the way. So how many combinations does that make, from Earth? 39*38*37*36*35*34*33 77,519,922,480 permutations. It takes generally more than 2 seconds for the inner ring of a stargate to properly complete a quarter of a spin. The spinning slows down when the targeted chevron is reached. The lock easily take another second. So that's about 3 seconds per symbol. The next symbol can only be on the other side of the stargate, and that's the maximum. So taking a quarter of a spin is a good average. That's a total of 21 seconds on the average. Restarting the activation will generall be done a couple seconds after that in case of a failure. Say 25 seconds for a full test before another test can be ran. Good. So to test all permutations from Earth, you need 1,937,998,062,000 seconds. Oh, that's *only* 614.535154 centuries. Note: I used a to count the seconds, because I had a full view of the ring, and it seemed good enough. shows that a symbol takes more time than two seconds to cover a quadrant (we can see that very briefly after one of the first locks, as we get a view of the HUD, and we see the ring starting spinning slowly again). The acceleration itself after one lock is most noticeable and takes close to a second. And there's just one solution on more than 77.5 billions which is going to work. But let's just pretend that they found someone who believed what Jackson believed, and would hold the same reasoning Jackson held, and would reach the same conclusion he did reach. Let's pretend it's some super duper AI that did it, and they found the right thing like within a week after finding the stargate. Let's also reduce this insanity to the weird idea that for some reason, by the time the UNSC arrives at Abydos, the state of this planet is exactly like in 1994 (and not 2163-2164, that's two centuries and a half later). Let's actually claim that ALL of the Goa'uld status is the same as of '94. So the Terran gate is connected to Abydos', and the UNSC sends... how many soldiers? What? A SPARTAN? One would ask why we have to find convoluted reasons to stick with what happened in the movie and the show, yet forget all of this when it comes to the people who are sent. They send marines. If Ra's men get defeated as they ring down, Ra will decide to leave right off the bat. If anyone tried to ring onbard Ra's ship without even knowing what's inside (that would be a completely unlikely course of action), we'd have to believe the marines know how the Goa'uld entered the pyramid, unless they saw them ring down. Which would assume the UNSC marines didn't settle outside of the building like it happened in the movie. That's a fuck load of a IFs. Of course, would they fail to capture or kill Ra, Ra would return with more men, and the Goa'uld could be warned about the "strange people" of Abydos this time. Which only makes things worse. So you certainly want the UNSC marines to capture or kill Ra. We'll see more later on.

I might do it if I could, but frankly, I've been quite disappointed by the staff behaviour over there, who bend the rules as long as they see fit, and forget to remain unbiased when their little friends get verbally molested by proper arguments -> Cpl_Facehugger holding Leo by the leash. That said, I got permabanned several months ago. I would just need to create an alt, play with some proxies or merely use my older account over there. But why bother? I'm going to get banned just as quickly the moment I bruise some fanboys' egos or even post over there. Styles are hard to mask, and I don't intend of masking anything. I speak my mind, that's all. Now, posting it here also has advantages, contrary to what you may think. First, and most obviously, there's no pussyfuck mod who's going to threaten me for my arguments, and that's very appreciated. Oh sure, some of them would laugh at the method, but that's just what they can do, since they have demonstrated showing any will to pay attention to arguments. Cunts are cunts. No time won trying to argue with them. They're also too busy silencing dissenting opinions that stick out of the so called "consensus". Secondly, I would PM anyone whom I want to know what my arguments are. It's perhaps odd, but it's not necessarily any different than what some posters do by replying to messages posted on foreign boards. Crossboard exchanges have already happened before. And it also means they won't be able to pretend they were not aware of it. After that, it doesn't really matter if most of the debaters who partook in the thread don't see what I wrote here. Going by the general quality of reflextion, most of the people who participated in the SBC thread would probably not get it anyway, otherwise they'd have surely voiced some of the counter arguments I presented there, which are rather obvious. You know, 30 pages of silliness where even the very few in between criticisms were purely ignored, that doesn't lie. Few guys proved to understand the situation, like Mith or l33telboi and, oh surprise, that's out little SFJN club! This is also useful here since I've seen this thread crop up several times, here and there (you know, something like UNSC vs Goa'uld, and most of the time without even the advantage of the stargates that would at least allow a faster dispersion of UNSC troops). So now I can point to it instead of repeating myself. It's even worse than I thought then. They must rely on Insurectionists to spread tagged weapons throughout whatever worlds the Insurectionists live on, which as far as I know, were a fraction of the outer colonies. This also increases the chances of the UNSC putting their hands on such weapons, oddly enough.

That one cracked me up. Mmm... right. Let me see... A couple posts earlier... that: Isn't it fantastic that in order to find excuses as to why the fantastic UNSC couldn't retro engineer Covenant tech, they actually end shooting themselves in the foot? See, if personnal shields were still immensely expensive at the end of the war - despite the importance of ground control as evidence by the clear victories obtained form their Spartans - how does it excuse the lack of implementation in the years prior to the end of the war? The damn war lasted 25 years. Also, what makes them think that what was uber expensive, and never managed to get cheaper even when the UNSC hadn't lost many planets, would suddenly turn out to be as cheap as potatoes on sticks during the "war" against the Goa'uld? Wait. It wouldn't. And nice to him to point out how the Covenant infantry weapons were actually far more deadly than the UNSC counterparts, even if they're not exactly obeying to the same doctrines. This is in line with the feeling I got from Halo:CE : UNSC rifles sucked, so much that anytime you could pick an alien weapon, you'd do it, if only to get the Elites down fast. Marines rifles were a complete waste of time. I haven't played the other games, the first one was just too fucking boring for anyone who has already played many FPS games on the PC. But let's not stop there! Nice to know it's impossible now. Oh, we're supposed to think all of what he cites as excuses won't happen against the Goa'uld. See for yourself: Ah. So even before the Covenant could actually make any major advance into UNSC territory, at a time even when the UNSC could actually win some battles in the Outer Colonies and even retake Harvest and when most, if not the entirety of the Inner Colonies were unmolested (that's a certain amount of worlds upon 800 colonies btw - and by the time of Reach, few colonies had been lost actually, as per the Reach Datapads), we're supposed to think the entire thing was already bankrupt? That's beyond silly. You know, all those ships and bases and so on would probably cost dozens if not hundreds of billions of current dollars. Per ship. That's without counting maintainance and potential retrofits. And yet, the UNSC can't spare some hundreds of millions on the understanding of ground weapons with obvious superior lethality, and a clear capacity to take down Covenant infantry shields in little time? That, the UNSC and its 800 colonies couldn't pull it off? This is supposed to be an excuse, and making it superior to the SGC, the same SGC which has been running on a limited shadow budget from a few nations, the same budget which got trimmed down later on? The same budget that allowed to build an entire ship, plus understanding and retro engineering several technologies (see post above)? See above. Yeah, because the UNSC obviously were engaging Covenant troops at longer ranges. Nevermind the fact that Covenant personnal shields and expandable Ugnauts let them close the distance anyway. Nevermind that Covenant weapons were far more effective at taking down Covenant troops. Yeah, why bother? I must have missed the part where all Marines were equipped with sniper rifles and engaged all Covenant troops at ranges of 250-300 meters on a regular basis. And it only gets stupider when you think about scaling this up: the Covenant ship weapons were not short ranged at all. Not only that, but they were not so exceptional either: the super AI Cortana noted that the design of those fusion guns on the Ascendent Justice was rather primitive. That said, she got the principle, but nothing proves she could build one. You don't want to get close to them only when you don't have weapons reliably capable of taking down their defenses. And you don't want to get close to Kull warriors either. They'd turn your marines into mince meat at any time, and they outnumber the Spartans. Besides, regarding the Kull's defenses, please notice that when bullets and bolts hit the flexible sections, the suit's shields actually stop them as well there - the trinium dart was an exception, most likely due to the presence of something negating the suit's shields, perhaps the cage's shield itself. Or perhaps the Kull having to activate it first. By the time it was up, there was shit they could do. Ah? Then you have to wonder why they continued the Spartan program and updated suit after suit then, if that all mattered was space anyway... and that even a long time after finding out that their real enemy was the Covenant, not the insurectionists. It's not like focusing efforts towards space combat would matter anyway, when a single Goa'uld ship as the firepower equivalent of between hundreds and tens of thousands of UNSC warships: shield and firepower calcs for Ha'taks >>> obvious low terajoule firepower for MACs; from Reach datapads, again. Talking about these insurectionists; did you know that a Prophet of the Covenant had secretly doned Covenant weapons to some insurectionists in order to have the UNSC waste its resources against them instead? Yes. The campaign for the eradication of humanity was going on so slowly, the advance of the Covenant forces into UNSC territories was so miserable, that a Prophet had to pull a totally heretical act in order to get things moving a bit in their favour? So scaling Covie tech was hard? Despite the presence of the super duper AIs to help out humanity? Funny how they quickly forget about them. Yes, you know, the AIs. They don't run on money. They run on electrical power. You can plug Cortana's sister to a solar panel array and let her run the calcs all day long for all I care. So... we're supposed to think, again, that those problems would conveniently cease to exist? And that disadvantage suddenly vanishes against the Goa'uld? By the way, he calls that an empire? The Goa'uld have visited far more of the galaxy (and had to cope with a galactic wide incursion by Replicator forces), but the UNSC is located in a small region of space. Somehow he thinks an "empire" that takes months to cover its smallish territory is going to be a threat to a force which takes at best weeks to cross the entire galaxy? Aside from shooting his own foot by attempting to find any possible excuse as to why the UNSC actually didn't retroengineer much Covenant tech, and forgetting that there's nothing that would warrant such burdens to be lifted when fighting against the Goa'uld? Nothing. ^^ The Covenant struggled to find human worlds of importance. The UNSC implemented the Cole Protocol 9 years after the declaration of war. That protocol worked quite well for several years after that. So well, in fact, that the Covenant finding Earth actually occured in the very last few years of the war. I guess the Covenant were too stupid to figure out that, with the slow FTL drives the UNSC relied on when they settled colonies, with the ability to chart space even from a single planet by using something as crude as a telescope, and with the capacity to send FTL probes left and right, they could actually easily find most UNSC worlds in no time flat. You know how long it took for the Goa'uld, after deeming Earth to be a relevant nuisance, to launch an attack against it? Two years, and that was Apophis, exploiting the power vacuum resulting from Ra's death, to gamble a coup and retake the world that kicked Ra away. Thor knew the Goa'uld would return with far more ships the moment they'd up the Tau'ri on their priority list. It's not like the Cole Protocol will do anything worth its salt when UNSC troops start using stargates, which will actually allow cloaked Ash'raks to return home along them, as pointed out in the former post. There's no reason for the UNSC to deploy their forces from expandable worlds when you consider how long it took them to implement the Cole Protocol. They were just that not careful much for almost a decade. All it takes is just one small beacon or/and a Goa'uld stun grenade to get things started, people and bases captured.

Guys, please. This is gross.

Damn, the UNSC retro engineering wanking is going on, full regime. Let's just remember that: 1. The UNSC has been at war with the Covenant for 27-28 years. http://www.halopedian.com/Human-Covenant_War 2. That important wars were fought since the beginning, well before the Halo 1, 2 and 3 games. I'm thinking of Harvest notably, where the humans even managed to retake the planet and hold it for quite some time, and winning several battles from there and in the outer colonies. All the more occasions to loot Covenant tech, if only at the basic infantry level. 3. Specialized AIs are nothing new, and Smart AIs existed since the mid 21st century. Yes, only that. http://www.halopedian.com/%22Smart%22_AI 4. As an example of retro-engineering, with the help of AIs, the first introduction of shield to a combat suit was made for the Mark V, following the works started after data collected from the Mark IVs. Work on the Mark V begun around 2542. That is, no less than 17 years after the beginning of the war. http://www.halopedian.com/MJOLNIR_Powered_Assault_Armor/Mark_V For some reason, M104, who's spending lots of time watching episodes to better hate the show he's forcing himself through, seems to think that only the last five years or so of the war matter. Comparatively, the SGC retroengineered a large number of key technologies from the Death Gliders, which they had in so little quantity that the X-301 was their sole model, and they lost it quickly. Even the X-303 held a good number of hybridization between technologies which the Tau'ri had to understand by themselves. Inertial dampening and artificial gravity were added to the 303 deck by deck. Some of them still didn't have it. Either the Tau'ri understood it, or reverse engineered it. The ship was in development for only two years. It's possible they had to upscale the technologies found on the X-301. In any way, it's a formidable achievement. They also had to develop their own ion thrusters. The Death Glider didn't have any (they use reaction less engines). Ring platforms were scavenged, and there's no telling if the shields were just picked from a Goa'uld ship or retro-engineered. The volume of a shield bubble is proportional to the power you fed it with, but it's obvious that it's not as good as designing to be that big from scratch. The railguns were another major achievement. The small stations had the firepower of the very large prototype models we build today, but rate of fire close to that of an autocannon. Metallurgy had progressed a lot as well, in that the Tau'ri easily got around the manipulation and alloying of trinium and naqahdah. And that with nowhere the budget, the time and industrial foundations of the UNSC. Plus we saw other knacks found later on by the Tau'ri. Haloites seem to think that the average level of science on Earth is the reference, entirely missing the fact that the SGC/IOA is a complete, isolated and different world - something which raises a considerable amount of ethical issues. Yet they never were able to threaten the Goa'uld. They seem to quickly forget that what took down the Goa'uld, at least the vast majority of them, was a galactic scale invasion by the Replicators. Small players, obviously. I've seen some other stupid claims. One from Monster 104 being that the UNSC would retro-engineer take within a few years (that's somewhere around the first pages of the thread) and surely defeat the Goa'uld after being close to unstoppable. Perhaps in his haste to ingest as many SG-1 episodes as possible per week, he missed the fact that it only took a few months for the Goa'uld to convene of a summit when Anubis was starting to wreck havok here and there. The Goa'uld were fighting each other after the fall of Apophis and Cronus. The remaining System Lords had been fighting for months, as per the Tok'ra Re'Nau, but suddenly it all stopped and the Tok'ra thought these System Lords were looking for a truce. So obviously, it didn't take long for the Goa'uld to meet as soon as someone decided to kick them in the balls (Anubis was only using his ships btw, eluding them about his identity) without playing by the rules. Ba'al even said that this sowed discord among them, which just shows us how all this in fighting is nothing like a real war at all. Oh, and the most amusing part is that we're supposed to think that the Goa'uld will not know where the attacks come from. The Goa'uld, who can send invisible Ash'raks through the same gate the UNSC troops would use to return, who can place any beacon on any UNSC ship, who have their own cloaked ships, who can take control of hosts and brainwash people, and who obviously know about Earth and a good number of other worlds, and who owned planets very close from Earth (Chulak, Abydos... a couple LY at most)... these guys, these Goa'uld, they won't be able to backtrace the humans back to the colony worlds and Earth... like if astrography was anything secret? Oh, you know when the UNSC/CAA decided to enforce the Cole Protocol, despite the open declation of war by the Covenant in 2525? 2534, or 9 years. That, of course, after countless colonies being lost, some of them glassed, and the Covenant making no mystery of their xenophobic motto. This is probably why Haloites were desperate to prove that the Asgard Treaty would exist even in that reality, despite all the obvious paradoxes I highlighted above, and the fact that humanity in SGverse survived by being an underdog and being extremely lucky in their first contacts. Not to point out the utter importance of the discovery of a portal on some planet destroyed by the Goa'uld which allowed Jackson to return with the coordinates to the stargate on Apophis' ship, at a moment he was not too far from the coordinates, which allowed SG-1 to get on board Apophis' ship. In the alt reality, the Goa'uld were taking their sweet time, relatively speaking, since they had been bombarding Earth for a very few days. But the SGC sending a nuke to Chulak had Apophis fly to the SGC while the casualties bursters (we even see the new map, showing large patches of destruction covering whole nations, which could only be managed by another Ha'tak - no problem, we know Apophis would have used two ships). The Goa'uld know where the humans come from. They know they were found on Tau'ri, and brought to Dakara to develop the first generations of Jaffa. Added to the Ash'raks, the Goa'uld do have some particularly efficient stun grenades, and other autosentries and deployable shields. http://stargate.wikia.com/wiki/Tac I won't even go over the paradox that in SGverse, without the intervention of the Tau'ri, it was only a question of time before Anubis would return, get to Dakara and wipe out all life in the galaxy before he'd reseed it.

Admins: please add a plugin to your website that automatically translates Jason's posts into English ASAP.

What? You want the name of his English grammar school book?

Dessolution: I made a silly thread wherein I thought the UNSC could own the Goa'uld, and you fuckers aren't allowed to make arguments that do make sense. And I will rely on double standards if I want to as well. http://forums.spaceb...3&postcount=655 http://forums.spaceb...4&postcount=656 http://forums.spaceb...4&postcount=657 http://forums.spaceb...4&postcount=658

If that's so, then you actually want to have the party land in Lebannon or in the Gaza strip. Or even Afghanistan. There you'll see good fighters. Israeli are given expensive weapons solely for comic relief these days.

When a thread is stupid, don't post in it. .... OOPS!!

Ships would receive a small fraction of the nukes' particle energy if they were detonated at a distance. If Covenant ships have a firepower in the low hundred terajoule range tops, it's impossible for MACs to range in the megaton. Only the SMAC should. And considering how a SMAC is more or less a long range sitting duck cannon, any advanced species which knows where to FTL in a system close to a targeted planet will have a clear LOS at the SMAC and blow it to confetti before it can even point its cannon in the right direction.

Just imagine. A zionist xenomorph.

I can't understand what he's trying to say.

Yes, that's 'em. I may have to reread the bit about Luke walking into a room while moving through the wall, it could have actually been an illusion. It's not that I treat wook as gospel, but it says that the Fallanassi have little control on the material side of things through the Force, and walking through a wall is pretty much extreme on the material scale. It offered a certain perspective. It may even have been a Fallanassi doing it for Luke, while masking his real entering into the room. Wook says they can do that, with their Force Immersion power. I notice that WotC had a supplement about these chicks and their order, but the article is lost in archives which I can't reach anymore. A search for "Tybis" gives me answers, but the links all bring me back to the WotC main page. Damn.

Yes but that's quite different from claiming surface slag. Now, a thing that should be done for Halo is a list, by book, of all the calculable events, beams, bombardment, use of nukes, explosives, hull penetration and destruction, etc., because after a while, having people refer to First Strike, Ghosts of Onyx, The Fall of Reach (old and new ed.) and else, it's hard to remember where the stuff comes from.